Curse

Red Sonya · Jan 12, 2006, 09:35 AM // 09:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mavrik

If you can't beat it, nerf it.

LOL I like that one best. But, I have to admit watching IWAY in action is fun to watch at least it's entertaining. I don't feel it needs to be nerfed though. Pets are allies and part of the group so they deserve to be put into the equation as much. People will just have to sit down and figure up some skills to counter it while still countering other builds as well.

Thing everyone should and must remember, you can't go into any battle thinking you have every type of build covered and you can't and you shouldn't be able to. You just must expect to lose as much as you expect to win. That's why the best guilds are organized and cordinated, they discuss instead of running blindly into a HOH battle or a GvG battle.

The whinners are for the most part just disorganized noobies who don't want their template they've copied already from someone else not working for the WIN! lol That's why this game is based on skill and intelligence. Before you cry nerf, why don't you try to use that little brain of yours to figure something out for yourself how to counter it. It's not impossible, in fact it's very simple if you just "read" what skills do.

Tailon · Jan 12, 2006, 09:59 AM // 09:59

IWAY isn't exactly hard to beat, so I don't see a need for a nerf. However, if necros can't exploit pet corpses, pets shouldn't trigger IWAY.

audioaxes · Jan 12, 2006, 07:24 PM // 19:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tailon

IWAY isn't exactly hard to beat, so I don't see a need for a nerf. However, if necros can't exploit pet corpses, pets shouldn't trigger IWAY.

correct me if im wrong but thought pets DO trigger necro corpse spells

Sir Green Aluminum · Jan 12, 2006, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Here's a anti- IWAY build my ye old guilde used before I left: Someone with at least quick cast corpse exploit spell, we used consume corpse. Ward against melee, aegis. Attack their necromancer.

I think Ranger spike wayy worse. The only two skills I can think of that can defend against archery is Deflect arrows and swirling aura. I hate savage shot!!!! It's worse than Disrupting shot!

Red Sonya · Jan 12, 2006, 10:31 PM // 22:31

Shields UP is very effective against archery and it recharges very quickly only a few seconds between reuse of it. Takes a lot of points into tactics though, but, with stance warriors being popular nowadays very useful skill to carry along for at least one of the warriors in the group.

perfect · Jan 13, 2006, 01:21 AM // 01:21

The only 'nerf' they should make is to change "I Will Avenge You!" to an elite skill. I have fought at least one IWAY 10 times in a row when holding halls, I didnt mind but its time to get some diversity back in halls.

yesitsrob · Jan 13, 2006, 02:22 AM // 02:22

When playing IWAY - I have a tendancy to slaughter them, or get slaughtered by them, warriors definitely have it easier when being ressed after dying, not really needing energy at all, a monk being ressed from a res signet is still pretty RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOed due to having very little energy and poorer armor, and with all IWAY toons having 8 sigs (most teams having 5), plus the killing the ghost recharging them it's a lot of sigs and constant pressure to deal with.

In tombs though ward against foes is a nice map for relic runs, and works great for kiting around in, aegis is a must. Warriors are probably the only class you need to really be prepared to deal with, that said, they do have a damn lot of skills that work against them, aegis, clumsiness, blindness, cripples to name a few. I personally think with warriors in general their DPS is a bit too good considering their high armor, and one or the other could do with being toned down a little imo. IWAYS _easy_ to counter? I don't agree, it's easy to counter an iway that is a lot less skilled than you are sure.... and if it was soo easy to counter, MATH wouldn't be ranked 33 in the ladder

I do agree that due to IWAYs rank has lost any form of meaning in judging skills (yet people still insist on using it, why? A series of questions is much better at judging someones ability imo). Teams with very little skill will, and often do get lucky with IWAY and beat teams that they aren't as good as. I've come across rank 6 players in CA, who I've known to run IWAY in tombs, trying to boon prot, or play mesmer, and it's really quite ammusing at times.

I think the Res Sig recharge on killing ghost benefits IWAYs more than most other tombs builds, I don't really see the need in it to be honest, you get enough chances with 8 res sigs. If you need to use that many, you deserve to lose if you ask me

Nerfing the skill IWAY? Hard to justify saying it shouldn't work off pets, if someone killed my pet in real life i'd be raging for a lot longer than 10 seconds ^^. Maybe capping it at a certain duration based on your str attribute

Seriously though, if anything it's making the tombs somewhat boring, facing the same build over and over. I'm on the american servers and it's just terrible there.... almost every tombs pick up group is iway, and requesting rank too, that's a joke... wasn't one of the original ideas behind IWAY so people could get into groups?

I've on occasion joined Rank 3 Iway groups and just rank 0 ones... and to be hoenst, they're as bad as each other most the time.

Hmm, frozen soil works great too against IWAY - rarely will you be the first to die against them, in Halls once.. guild Peace and Harmony were holding... and they came near our fight at the start and dropped a frozen that the IWAY team couldn't get to, they moaned like hell... we on the other were greatful

BuddyLeeX · Feb 13, 2006, 04:31 PM // 16:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divine Elemental

Be happy With IWAY
Its Free Fame.

Quiters Never Win
Winners Never Quit.

True Enough Statement. / You Are Complaining to a Build Easily Countered...
True Enough that This build is Poluting TopK... Why Ask a Nerf?
Since Its So Versatile, Why Wont They Hold for More Than 4? @ HoH...
IWAY Should Remain as It Is, Dont Cry About It.
If You Lose To It... Your Group is Bad..

So true! And guess what, I knew that quote sounded familiar, yes I have played against this guy in a r3/6+ IWAY group, and they dominated us. So why does everyone complain about IWAY, its so counterable. I think the people who complain about IWAY are the idiots who can't beat IWAY and who don't practice with a group or guild group long enough to build some skill to counter teams like IWAY.

Esprit · Feb 13, 2006, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Quote:

I think the people who complain about IWAY are the idiots who can't beat IWAY and who don't practice with a group or guild group long enough to build some skill to counter teams like IWAY.

Not everyone plays HoH seriously. There are a lot of guilds who go in there just to have some fun, test out builds, and see how far they can get with it. But with so many people playing IWAY, it is kind of annoying to have to put something in your build to counteract IWAY.

My guild tested out an Earthquake + Echo'ed Aftershock build, which did fine at the beginning of the first HoH battle, but once we killed their pets and 6 Warriors did a focus fire IWAY, it just fell apart. But we won't know how good the build does against other builds, because IWAY is so common.

I enjoy playing teams who are testing out builds, but fighting IWAY teams, ALL THE TIME, discourages that.

Kakumei · Feb 13, 2006, 06:36 PM // 18:36

At least it's confirmed they're altering it.

For better or for worse.

Zehnchu · Feb 13, 2006, 06:57 PM // 18:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by audioaxes

iway is not overpowered and thus doesnt need to be nerfed
if you cant beat iway as a balanced team without becoming an "anti iway" build then thats your problem (my guild can win iway with just a Me/E with a 16sec ward v melee and aegis)
if you nerf iway builds then you need to nerf ranger spike, obsidian flame spike, and any other decent tombs build

I am waiting to see the day after the rebalance hits, it’s not just going to affect iway builds.

Mandy Memory · Feb 13, 2006, 09:48 PM // 21:48

Sadly, an IWAY team can still be good even if noone brings the skill IWAY. (Ive seen it with 4 w/n with weaken armor etc.)

shardfenix · Feb 14, 2006, 03:44 AM // 03:44

They are not nerfing IWAY because it is good. It is in fact effortless to beat with most balance/ranger spike builds. They are nerfing IWAY because it is preventing the good players from having fun. It now takes an hour to find a non-iway group, when months ago it took a few minutes.
The other reason they are nerfing IWAY is because most players who are rank 9 now got there through IWAY. IWAY made rank meaningless. I wouldnt be surprised if they scrapped the current rank system, in fact i cant wait to see it reset.

mattjones527 · Feb 14, 2006, 04:18 AM // 04:18

After the iway nerf I feel sorry for anyone guildless whos under rank 3. Think about it, with so many people that IGAYed their rank to rank 3, theres are going to be tons of rank 3 players who cant play many other builds. So as people start to see how "noobish" these rank 3 players are at anything but iway, they are going to have even less regard for under rank 3. So anyone whos not rank 3 and w/o a guild will be stuck at their current rank, with no cookie cutter build to grind fame with.

mattjones527 · Feb 14, 2006, 04:18 AM // 04:18

After the iway nerf I feel sorry for anyone guildless whos under rank 3. Think about it, with so many people that IGAYed their rank to rank 3, theres are going to be tons of rank 3 players who cant play many other builds. So as people start to see how "noobish" these rank 3 players are at anything but iway, they are going to have even less regard for under rank 3. So anyone whos not rank 3 and w/o a guild will be stuck at their current rank, with no cookie cutter build to grind fame with.

brybry · Feb 14, 2006, 05:55 AM // 05:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Green Aluminum

Here's a anti- IWAY build my ye old guilde used before I left: Someone with at least quick cast corpse exploit spell, we used consume corpse. Ward against melee, aegis. Attack their necromancer.

I think Ranger spike wayy worse. The only two skills I can think of that can defend against archery is Deflect arrows and swirling aura. I hate savage shot!!!! It's worse than Disrupting shot!

deflect arrows? swirling aura? LOL
wow...someone need to teach this guy about tombs.
*cough* infuse *cough*

Senator Tom · Feb 14, 2006, 06:01 AM // 06:01

hi rohan, join my guild

Soul Shaker · Feb 14, 2006, 08:49 AM // 08:49

I forsee it being changed back to what it used to be. For all dead allies wait for it... in the area

instead of being every dead ally...

Hockster · Feb 14, 2006, 08:55 AM // 08:55

As America only has favor for one round a day lately, that shows how easy WAY is to counter. But as most American players are only concerned with rank and faction farming, it's unlikely to change. Glad I moved my accounts into Europe.

thunderpower · Feb 14, 2006, 10:01 AM // 10:01

First of all the problem with iway is not that it can't be beaten. The problem is that there are to many iway teams around HA, making HA boring.

It's a fact.

Where are the great guilds that used to play in tombs (now HA)? I can't beleive that each and every of them disbanded. They got bored just like many others.

The truth is, that iway can be beaten, each and every version of it. But it's just boring to do the same thing over and over again.
If you observed Ronin Corpse (the HA team), they use a quite old balanced build, wich had many problems (before iway getting so popular) getting to HoH and holding it. I know cuz i played that build with some of the ronin players (the ones that play in HA, cuz the GvG core is 100% corean and they rarely or never play in HA). But lately they win and hold in HoH many times.

I think iway wont be nerfed. ANET said "iway wont be a problem after february". So IWAY wont be a problem, not that IWAY will be nerfed. So they'll just modify something so that iway(and subversions) will be playable if you are skilled, if not you'll get owned by 4 noobs using henchies.

About the rank issue, that many people will have high rank and so on... This game is called GUILD wars, not GUILDLESS wars. So the your aim should be to make friends, make or join a guild, practice with them, see how good you can get.
Istead of hanging around HA and complaining that you can't get a group, that you don't play iway, that you have no rank, that every1 else is fame/faction farming with IWAY, and so on... Better try to spend some time finding a guild or make some friends and play with them (my advice, you can still idle in HA spamming).

Anyway, after all this iway rage will be over, unranked people will have yet again a chance to get into groups, since there will be many high rank/fame farmers who will be worth sh*t when palying anything else than warr.

And yes, now it's a real bad time to start pvping in HA. So wait till all this crap is over (or solved). If you just got the game and you're intrested in just the PvP part (namely HA), bad luck.

And just as a last comment: GvG and HA are two diffrent things.
If a guild plays this ot that build in HA it doesn't mean that they use the same build in GvG. Also it doesn't mean that the same team that plays in HA also plays GvG. Top 50 guilds usually have diffrent teams for that. Just take a look at the guild ladder and see how many of the top guilds have a HA team, and see if it's the same people playing on those teams.